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Subject: Re: MS-DOS Kermit, more capabalities
From: [e-mail]
Message-ID: <uMPj4.128$[e-mail]>
Organization: bCandid - Powering the world's discussions - http://bCandid.com
Date: Thu, 27 Jan 2000 04:24:58 GMT
To: [e-mail]


Hello Joe -

I'm baayyccckkk!

On 1900-01-25 [e-mail](JoeDoupnik) said:

JD>Newsgroups: comp.protocols.kermit.misc

JD>In article <[e-mail]>, not-2-disclose@the.
JD>>net writes:  Hi Joe,

JD>> About "MS-DOS Kermit, more capabalities" of January 1, 5, 7 and 18

JD>>MS> I  introduce  myself, i'm a DOS_InterNet user and spent about the last
JD>>MS> two    years  lurking/participating  to  the  same-name  echo  of  the
JD>>MS> `FidoNet'  amateur  messaging network. Since the last four years or so
JD>>MS> i  looked  for  DOS  INet FreeWare/ShareWare programs in hope that i'd
JD>>MS> get  my  hands  on  some  piece of software which can be run even on a
JD>>MS> minimum setup, meaning: - 8088 4,77 Mhz ~CPU~ - 640 Kb ~RAM~... ..

JD>>MS> TO  UPGRADE  THE  HARDWARE OR TO SWITCH TO PROTOCOLS LIKE ~FTP~/~HTTP~
JD>>MS> *IS NOT* AN OPTION.

JD>>JRD> 486 and Pentium motherboards are basically free for the asking...

You  see  Michel  said this was not an option and was ignored. The folklore of
free  `486s  is  probably  true  if  you  work  in academia where they get new
equipment  for  free  or  in  the government where they place no value on what
they no longer require. For the rest of us even scrap metal has a price tag.

JD>> I  finally read your messages (not just short spasmodic quoted fragments)
JD>> which you intended as a reply to my previous posts.

Your  choice  of  `spasmodic'  lends that feeling of "just wanting to help" to
your reply.

JD>>MS> Most  unfortunately, nothing you can write makes it to my news server;
JD>>MS> i  called  my  ~ISP~  and  one  of  their clerck explained me that YOU
JD>>MS> PROBABLY  ARE  USING  ONE  OF  YOUR  APPLICATION'S OPTION TO LIMIT THE
JD>>MS> PROPAGATION  of  your  messages. If it's true that you have too little
JD>>MS> time at hand then you will want to spend a

JD> ----------

JD> I  will make this brief. Stop accusing people. Then please understand just
JD> a  bit  more how News is propagated as storing and forwarding, merging and
JD> splitting  of  streams  of  messages, some of which relays drop or repeat.
JD> Hours  or  days may pass, relay links may be highly unreliable, etc. It is
JD> not my end of things.

What  you  say  is true but there are ways to toss a monkey wrench into things
which  is why you locked out port #25. That particular port was probably being
used  to feed back some of the attitude that was received here originally. You
locked it out in self-defense. 8)

JD> Zmodem  isn't in the works for MS-DOS Kermit. I've said that several times
JD> now.

Refusing  to  allow  the  MSKermit terminal app to use external protocols (via
the  `int  14h'  hook) is the irrational behaviour of a zealot and unworthy of
an educated individual. All terminal apps allow this, MSK is the exception.

JD> Nor  will  port  25  to be opened, for what I consider good and sufficient
JD> reasons  both  technical and ethical. Folks may honestly disagree, but the
JD> decision stands.

Personally,  I  don't  care  about port #25 but I can see why `the team' would
fear it's use. 8)

JD> To decode your script problems I suggest first reducing the number

--8<--cut

JD> I  will  not  go  on  about this, but the speed problems you are concerned
JD> about  are  most likely due to the simplistic implementation of the Kermit
JD> protocol  in  the  BBS  systems  you  contact.  Had  they  done  a  better
JD> implementation  things  could  go  faster.  It's not the method of putting
JD> bits  on  the  wire,  it  is  the  nature  of how much is sent when at the
JD> protocol level.

Michel  and  I  have  discussed  this  many  times  and  we  both  really _do_
understand what you are referring to here.

What  we  have  said was that when the kermit implemented on the BBS is fouled
beyond  a  reasonable  point  then being able to shift to an external protocol
for _that_ BBS would be a huge plus.

JD> That  ought  to  help reduce the number of comms techniques to worry about
JD> (and  you  have a bunch in hand). At some point your 8088 machine runs out
JD> of  cpu  cycles and the floppy drive remains slow. Those too will place an
JD> upper limit on speed.

Neither  Michel  nor  I  have  said  that  MSKermit is slow on the 8088 or any
machine  that  we  know  of. In fact, we have both said the opposite. MSKermit
maintains  consistently  high  transfer  rates  on those systems with a proper
kermit  implementation. A few FTP transfers will match MSK but generally never
exceed MSK transfer rates.

The  point  being  that the IP stack seems to function properly when others do
not.  If  external  protocols  could  access  this it would be a fall back for
those BBS with poor or no kermit transfer.

JD> Lastly, we have pointed you to the source code more than once.

I  was directed to something like 4 or 5 different places and the code was not
there.

JD> I  did  so  on  my  machines:  try  netlab2.usu.edu, directory kermit. Try
JD> netlab1.usu. edu, directory pub/mirror/kermit.

The  first  time  I  went  to  these  the code was not there and access to the
`mirror'  directory  was denied. Since that time it _was_ there (the last time
I  looked) and I did download v315. Newer beta versions of v316 are also there
in binaries.

For some reason the `wermit' server is not being kept up to date?

Is  any of v316 beta??? source code ever going to be made available, it's been
beta for years now.

JD> Try  a  web browser or anonymous ftp. I can't help more than that and I do
JD> hope you are successful this time.

"I can't help more than that" is not quite accurate.

No  one has said that adding access to external protocols will damage MSKermit
or  that it can't be done. The reasons given for _not_ doing this are personal
preference  that demands that MSK remain as it is, a one protocol terminal app
with no option but to disconnect if the other end cannot handle kermit.

With  your  years of working with the code it shouldn't take very long for you
to  determine  if  adding  a  `hook' for exernal protocols is feasible without
major surgery.

>
>        ,                          ,
>      o/      Charles.Angelich      \o       ,
>     <|        @AngelFire.com        |>  __o/
>     / >          USA, MI           < \   __\__